I saw this article in the LFPress and decided that I had to ask Van Holst, the Ward 1 Councillor for London, owner of candy hearts, former science teacher, climate change skeptic denier, and the only councillor to refuse to answer the question “Are you vaccinated?” a different question:
?️ Me: Why are you pushing anti-vaxx propaganda talking points in the city council?
??? Van Holst: Where did you hear that?
?️ Me: In an LFPress article:
Ward 11 Coun. Stephen Turner took the gloves off, by his own description, to shoot down a letter from Coun. Michael van Holst about potential “oppression” of vaccine mandates at Tuesday’s city council meeting.
He lambasted his colleague for “questioning the efficacy” of COVID-19 vaccines and sowing doubt about their role.
“The overwhelming majority of scientists who have evaluated these vaccines and the programs are in lockstep with each other that this is the appropriate course of action. (There’s) significant evidence, overwhelming consensus, and on top of that, there’s been an incredible demonstration of efficacy,” said Turner, who just started a new job as head of the Lambton County EMS. The career change frees him from a previous conflict that forced him to recuse from public health discussions while working for the Middlesex-London Health Unit.
“I’m a little bit worked up about this because I spent the last six months of my life trying to make sure that we can get as many people vaccinated as possible, so we can put this (pandemic) to bed.”
Council voted 14-1 to take no action on van Holst’s proposal to have a city hall anti-oppression committee weigh up vaccine mandates. Van Holst was opposed, and all others were in favour.
https://lfpress.com/news/local-news/city-council-briefs-townhouses-approved-odd-vaccine-push-ignored
Van Holst: I saw the article, but it didn’t quote me at all. I did mention that I have friends who are disappointed in their vaccine because it doesn’t prevent you from catching, transmitting or getting sick from COVID.
It does prevent the most serious bad outcomes but those are remote possibilities for most people anyway.
I mentioned (and Councillor Cassidy also brought it up) that some people are not supposed to take the vaccine. For instance, I know someone who already has problems with heart inflammation, which has been one of the vaccine side effects.
I don’t subscribe to the pro/anti rhetoric that the paper sets up to create controversy. Both sides can say something that is true. I like to repeat those things.
?️ Me: Are you vaccinated?
??? Van Holst: <provides a link to an article where he refused to indicate if he was vaccinated>
Me: Yes, I saw that article too, you are literally just helping to fuel the people that are vehemently anti vaccine by pulling stunts like that
No, it never does [prevent you from getting covid 100%], that’s how vaccines and the human body work, as a former science educator you should be able to help [your friends] understand that
??? Van Holst: What do you think this vaccine does?
?️ Me: As you said: “prevent the most serious bad outcomes”. That’s the most basic way of putting it anyway, you don’t know how getting covid will actually affect you so giving your body extra chances to fight it off is a good idea.
??? Van Holst: for the person who takes it. So why do we need to be concerned if other people don’t want to take it. What would be our motiviatetion [sic] to strip them of their right to informed consent?
?️ Me: That’s an anti-vaxx talking point. What about my right to not be exposed to a potentially deadly virus? What about those that are immunocompromised, or those like your friend that has a heart condition and actually cannot get the vaccine, do they not get the right to feel safe?
??? Van Holst: Is your chance of being exposed when you meet a vaccinated person different then when you encounter an unvaccinated person?
?️ Me: the chances that the unvaccinated person has the virus are higher, because being unvaccinated goes along with doing things that expose you to more situations where you are likely to pick up covid so yes
It seems like you haven’t looked at any of the more recent data that has been put out about infection rates among the unvaccinated and the vaccinated.
If that is your position why do we make sure that kids are up to date on their vaccinations to participate in school? Could it be because vaccines work.
??? Van Holst: Vaccines don’t work just because they are vaccines. Vaccines are specific tools for specific situations and they may or may not work. This upcoming flu season will be revealing if we start counting the people who actually get sick as cases. A positive PCR test is not always a reliable measure. I have to go now, but you are welcome to continue the thread.
?️ Me: do you seriously think that the cases of the flu were reported as covid cases?
Lots of anti vaccine talking points in there for someone who doesn’t “subscribe to the pro/anti [vaccine] rhetoric”:
- I know someone who already has problems with heart inflammation, which has been one of the vaccine side effects.
- This one is subtle and I missed it initially, but the risk of heart inflammation is a lot higher for people that get COVID19. This should be a discussion with their doctor, it is not a blanket “don’t get the vaccine” or “do get the vaccine”. The fewer people that get the vaccine, the more times the doctor will say “yes, get it, the risk is greater to you without” and vice versa.
- It doesn’t prevent you from catching, transmitting or getting sick from COVID19
- No vaccine is 100% effective against catching the virus this is a problem with science communication and setting expectations
- It [only prevents] the most serious bad outcomes but those are remote possibilities for most people anyway.
- Why strip them of their right to informed consent?
- This is a common talking point, often “something something my freedom is being taken away”, but what about other people’s freedom to not be put in danger? Their freedom to actually be able to go to the hospital for treatment if they are sick from something that is not covid? That can’t happen if all of the beds are full, just look at Florida right now. It’s harder for governments to put restrictions on people, but not impossible, it’s also possible for universities to do it too, you have to be vaccinated (or have a valid exemption) to attend school, you have to wear clothes in a restaurant to name a few.
- This upcoming flu season will be revealing if we start counting the people who actually get sick as cases
